Comments on: The Free Beauty Squadron http://www.getmiro.com/blog/2007/10/the-free-beauty-squadron/ Sat, 07 Nov 2009 10:33:08 -0500 http://wordpress.org/?v=2.8.5 hourly 1 By: Davros http://www.getmiro.com/blog/2007/10/the-free-beauty-squadron/comment-page-1/#comment-50559 Davros Thu, 15 Jan 2009 14:53:53 +0000 http://www.getmiro.com/blog/2007/10/the-free-beauty-squadron/#comment-50559 I realise that this post is over a year old, but just in case someone checks it again, I have an idea to propose. How about we start off with the same idea in mind but on a smaller scale with the goal of buidling to what is described above. We get some guys who at least think they have good ideas about interface design and know something of the theoretical background of such things and they give it a go with whomever is brave enough to try it first and do so via the Internet. Maybe it will work. And if two or three projects feel they benefit from the experience, perhaps it will grow. Grow to include more formally recognized experts, grow to find some way to be sponsored (at least a little bit) so some in person meetings could be held, grow to inspire free software developers and freeware software devleopers alike to think more about usability during their coding. Using unknown talent to make something look prettier and to make it more usable sounds way more plausible to me than the idea of unpaid programmers creating operating systems, office suites, web browsers, 3D animation packages and so on all for free. Something to ponder. Would anyone else feel it is worth while to try? I realise that this post is over a year old, but just in case someone checks it again, I have an idea to propose.

How about we start off with the same idea in mind but on a smaller scale with the goal of buidling to what is described above.

We get some guys who at least think they have good ideas about interface design and know something of the theoretical background of such things and they give it a go with whomever is brave enough to try it first and do so via the Internet.

Maybe it will work. And if two or three projects feel they benefit from the experience, perhaps it will grow. Grow to include more formally recognized experts, grow to find some way to be sponsored (at least a little bit) so some in person meetings could be held, grow to inspire free software developers and freeware software devleopers alike to think more about usability during their coding.

Using unknown talent to make something look prettier and to make it more usable sounds way more plausible to me than the idea of unpaid programmers creating operating systems, office suites, web browsers, 3D animation packages and so on all for free.

Something to ponder. Would anyone else feel it is worth while to try?

]]> By: links for 2007-10-02 - cebidae: the blog of david dean http://www.getmiro.com/blog/2007/10/the-free-beauty-squadron/comment-page-1/#comment-36823 links for 2007-10-02 - cebidae: the blog of david dean Fri, 26 Oct 2007 23:59:05 +0000 http://www.getmiro.com/blog/2007/10/the-free-beauty-squadron/#comment-36823 [...] Miro - Internet TV Blog » Blog Archive » The Free Beauty Squadron What if there was a mini-organization that would hire a great interface designer to work with different open-source projects for 2 months at a time developing improved interfaces and user experiences? (tags: gui opensource design) [...] [...] Miro – Internet TV Blog » Blog Archive » The Free Beauty Squadron What if there was a mini-organization that would hire a great interface designer to work with different open-source projects for 2 months at a time developing improved interfaces and user experiences? (tags: gui opensource design) [...]

]]> By: Enigmachine http://www.getmiro.com/blog/2007/10/the-free-beauty-squadron/comment-page-1/#comment-35211 Enigmachine Wed, 03 Oct 2007 16:21:15 +0000 http://www.getmiro.com/blog/2007/10/the-free-beauty-squadron/#comment-35211 You get a better payoff by designing your software to an interface (API) and then letting folks (third party, open source, professionnal designer, etc) design skins or UIs for it. I can quote two big reasons right off the bat: 1) You can't be everything to everyone with a single UI design. 2) By designing to an API, people can integrate your stuff into their systems and make mashups. Take Miro for instance - I use it on a TV. The experience of using it on a 640x480 screen has been degrading ever since version 0.84 or something like that... The show names are hard to read (mostly because the reds bleed on my TV) and you don't have a 12 foot UI, and also I can't find the 'watch all unread' menu command anymore. Now if Miro had an easy API (with commands such as 'addVidcast', 'playUnread', 'getAllThumbnails' or something) and a default basic interface, it would be relatively trivial for someone such as I to create a totally new 'HTPC' interface where I can use my remove to navigate between shows and see all the data I need to see (instead of this pseudo iTunes stuff... surely one of the buggiest and most frustrating UIs I have recently used). One could also plug Miro into, say, MediaPortal and use MP as the GUI. It's very much the 'Hypercard' approach... Make the tools to build your interface and people will make the interface themselves. So to sum up... Yes, getting a 'star' designer to lovingly fashion your default UI is a great idea, but the practical approach is to design to an interface, and then get your star designer AND open-source skinners to make it shine. It's a good idea to get your star designer on board early on - after all you want to make sure your API supports a good useability flow - but if the software does what it's supposed to do and does it well, then the UI designer can focus on conveying that flow to the user well. The real trick to getting a good flow and software that's easy to use isn't to rely on an 'expert', it's to use the 'eat your own dog food' approach. imho. :) You get a better payoff by designing your software to an interface (API) and then letting folks (third party, open source, professionnal designer, etc) design skins or UIs for it.

I can quote two big reasons right off the bat:
1) You can’t be everything to everyone with a single UI design.
2) By designing to an API, people can integrate your stuff into their systems and make mashups.

Take Miro for instance – I use it on a TV. The experience of using it on a 640×480 screen has been degrading ever since version 0.84 or something like that… The show names are hard to read (mostly because the reds bleed on my TV) and you don’t have a 12 foot UI, and also I can’t find the ‘watch all unread’ menu command anymore.

Now if Miro had an easy API (with commands such as ‘addVidcast’, ‘playUnread’, ‘getAllThumbnails’ or something) and a default basic interface, it would be relatively trivial for someone such as I to create a totally new ‘HTPC’ interface where I can use my remove to navigate between shows and see all the data I need to see (instead of this pseudo iTunes stuff… surely one of the buggiest and most frustrating UIs I have recently used). One could also plug Miro into, say, MediaPortal and use MP as the GUI.

It’s very much the ‘Hypercard’ approach… Make the tools to build your interface and people will make the interface themselves.

So to sum up… Yes, getting a ’star’ designer to lovingly fashion your default UI is a great idea, but the practical approach is to design to an interface, and then get your star designer AND open-source skinners to make it shine.

It’s a good idea to get your star designer on board early on – after all you want to make sure your API supports a good useability flow – but if the software does what it’s supposed to do and does it well, then the UI designer can focus on conveying that flow to the user well. The real trick to getting a good flow and software that’s easy to use isn’t to rely on an ‘expert’, it’s to use the ‘eat your own dog food’ approach.

imho. :)

]]> By: JaneP http://www.getmiro.com/blog/2007/10/the-free-beauty-squadron/comment-page-1/#comment-35192 JaneP Wed, 03 Oct 2007 10:44:25 +0000 http://www.getmiro.com/blog/2007/10/the-free-beauty-squadron/#comment-35192 I rather use a functional simple looking app than a cute UI based one, any given day. In my opinion, I think is Great that many open source projects keep it simple and unpretentious. Sad will be the day when they all want to look cute or "elegant". To each his own. I rather use a functional simple looking app than a cute UI based one, any given day. In my opinion, I think is Great that many open source projects keep it simple and unpretentious. Sad will be the day when they all want to look cute or “elegant”. To each his own.

]]> By: Open Parenthesis http://www.getmiro.com/blog/2007/10/the-free-beauty-squadron/comment-page-1/#comment-35146 Open Parenthesis Tue, 02 Oct 2007 20:27:47 +0000 http://www.getmiro.com/blog/2007/10/the-free-beauty-squadron/#comment-35146 <strong>Free (as in Freedom, not as in Beer) Beauty Squadron...</strong> Nicholas Reville has an interesting post yesterday at miro (”The Free Beauty Squadron“) about the challenge of good interface design which has classically plagued open-source projects, especially on the desktop: Open-source software project... Free (as in Freedom, not as in Beer) Beauty Squadron…

Nicholas Reville has an interesting post yesterday at miro (”The Free Beauty Squadron“) about the challenge of good interface design which has classically plagued open-source projects, especially on the desktop:
Open-source software project…

]]> By: Dean Jansen http://www.getmiro.com/blog/2007/10/the-free-beauty-squadron/comment-page-1/#comment-35145 Dean Jansen Tue, 02 Oct 2007 19:47:19 +0000 http://www.getmiro.com/blog/2007/10/the-free-beauty-squadron/#comment-35145 Nathan, Thanks for the heads up on the comment link -- it should be fixed now. Nathan,

Thanks for the heads up on the comment link — it should be fixed now.

]]> By: Aaron Strontsman http://www.getmiro.com/blog/2007/10/the-free-beauty-squadron/comment-page-1/#comment-35138 Aaron Strontsman Tue, 02 Oct 2007 18:37:35 +0000 http://www.getmiro.com/blog/2007/10/the-free-beauty-squadron/#comment-35138 I absolutely agree to your post, it's bad that open-source's achievements often only find their way to consumers through commercial software. Some of my favourite open-source software could really use this, I think about Stardict ("screen real estate management" [sic!], OS integration meaning mostly icons), Notepad++ (menu, options window, English locale), 7-Zip (icons, menu and context menu structure), and maybe even Openoffice (OS integration, icons! icons!, response time and flickering effects). By the way: I'd greatly appreciate if Miro were looking less Macossy on Windows. I absolutely agree to your post, it’s bad that open-source’s achievements often only find their way to consumers through commercial software.
Some of my favourite open-source software could really use this, I think about Stardict (”screen real estate management” [sic!], OS integration meaning mostly icons), Notepad++ (menu, options window, English locale), 7-Zip (icons, menu and context menu structure), and maybe even Openoffice (OS integration, icons! icons!, response time and flickering effects).
By the way: I’d greatly appreciate if Miro were looking less Macossy on Windows.

]]> By: Rob http://www.getmiro.com/blog/2007/10/the-free-beauty-squadron/comment-page-1/#comment-35108 Rob Tue, 02 Oct 2007 08:05:13 +0000 http://www.getmiro.com/blog/2007/10/the-free-beauty-squadron/#comment-35108 Interesting idea. That said, shouldn't code and GUI go hand-in-hand? I think if more developers really spent time focusing on the GUI and user experience, apps wouldn't be so bloated and complicated. It seems like a lot of developers get so fixated on delivering features that they fail to think about how the user will actualy USE them. I don't think designing a good GUI is exceptionally hard. There are so many excellent examples out there. But, for a coder, it means thinking about your app in a different light, about the flow of information and actions. And it sometimes (often) means simplifying your solution, not adding more to the mix. All of that said, I do agree that the GUI is key. Pixelmator is an excellent example. Absolutely stunning. Interesting idea. That said, shouldn’t code and GUI go hand-in-hand? I think if more developers really spent time focusing on the GUI and user experience, apps wouldn’t be so bloated and complicated. It seems like a lot of developers get so fixated on delivering features that they fail to think about how the user will actualy USE them. I don’t think designing a good GUI is exceptionally hard. There are so many excellent examples out there. But, for a coder, it means thinking about your app in a different light, about the flow of information and actions. And it sometimes (often) means simplifying your solution, not adding more to the mix.

All of that said, I do agree that the GUI is key. Pixelmator is an excellent example. Absolutely stunning.

]]> By: Nathan Jones http://www.getmiro.com/blog/2007/10/the-free-beauty-squadron/comment-page-1/#comment-35069 Nathan Jones Tue, 02 Oct 2007 02:08:45 +0000 http://www.getmiro.com/blog/2007/10/the-free-beauty-squadron/#comment-35069 I like the idea, even though I'm not the rich geek you need to get it off the ground. I see similarities to Google's Summer of Code, in which students are sponsored to code for a project that has applied to Google. Having one designer employed full-time would be good, but getting different people onto shorter gigs could also work. BTW, you need to fix the "leave a response" link on the blog - because the page has a base href="http://www.getmiro.com/", "leave a response" links back to http://www.getmiro.com/#respond I like the idea, even though I’m not the rich geek you need to get it off the ground. I see similarities to Google’s Summer of Code, in which students are sponsored to code for a project that has applied to Google. Having one designer employed full-time would be good, but getting different people onto shorter gigs could also work.

BTW, you need to fix the “leave a response” link on the blog – because the page has a base href=”http://www.getmiro.com/”, “leave a response” links back to http://www.getmiro.com/#respond

]]> By: Greg K Nicholson http://www.getmiro.com/blog/2007/10/the-free-beauty-squadron/comment-page-1/#comment-35058 Greg K Nicholson Mon, 01 Oct 2007 23:53:27 +0000 http://www.getmiro.com/blog/2007/10/the-free-beauty-squadron/#comment-35058 Andre, it's not an either/or proposition: if the designers weren't contributing GUI mockups and designs, they'd be contributing <em>nothing</em>, rather than working code. (Incidentally, speaking of UI and Miro, will Miro's {main menu / sources panel / that bit to the left of the good stuff where you pick something to watch} be getting a sprinkling of Gnome-nativeness love in the near future?) Andre, it’s not an either/or proposition: if the designers weren’t contributing GUI mockups and designs, they’d be contributing nothing, rather than working code.

(Incidentally, speaking of UI and Miro, will Miro’s {main menu / sources panel / that bit to the left of the good stuff where you pick something to watch} be getting a sprinkling of Gnome-nativeness love in the near future?)

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